'AITA for telling my disabled coworker she shouldn’t need to lie on dating apps?' UPDATED
"AITA for telling my disabled coworker she shouldn’t need to lie on dating apps?"
This is a tough one and I’m genuinely curious to know what people think, so here goes.I have a coworker called Caroline, who as you can guess, is disabled. She’s in a motorised wheelchair, and can’t really move a lot but is still very capable of her job (and a lovely, fun person in general btw!).
We were talking on a break about dating and dating apps, how I had never used one and how she did, talking about her experiences. Casual conversation, really, and we were careful not to go into detail or anything or make each other uncomfortable till this came up.
She brought up how she didn’t disclose that she was in a wheelchair/disabled on her Tinder bio because it tended to scare people off or make people uncomfortable when they chat through the app.
This confused me because it’s very obvious she is in a wheelchair and if they went on a date in person they would find that out very fast - there is absolutely no way she can function in daily life without it, so she can’t exactly stash it nearby or something and just sit on a chair during the date.
She also told me that she does not tell them AT ALL until they show up to the date and see the fact she is in a wheelchair right in front of them. Anyway, I, maybe stupidly, pointed out that is it not dishonest to not share that she is in a wheelchair on her bio, or disclose it to potential partners before meeting for the first time?
She told me that everyone on dating apps lies about stuff so she didn’t see the big deal. I told Caroline that it’s not like hiding you have a twin or an accent or a particular way of looking, this is something that will heavily impact their dating life with you and they should be aware of that going in.
She’s a wonderful person and shouldn’t feel awkward about it, and there are plenty of people out there who aren’t phased by their partners being in wheelchairs, so I didn’t think she should lie about it. She went off in a huff saying I didn’t understand, but now I’m worried I’ve somehow been the AH by telling her this.
I know it’s not really my business and I never would have told her this if she didn’t ask me/hadn’t brought the subject up at all. I just didn’t want to lie to her about what I thought and I tried to be tactful but I think it blew up in my face. AITA?
Quick clarifications: she asked what I thought when she mentioned how she hid her disability on the app, I’m guessing she saw my surprise in my face when she said that. I would NEVER tell her, or anyone, my opinion on a delicate matter like this if they didn’t ask me first.
The internet was deeply invested in the situation.
its_about_thecones wrote:
NAH. I would recommend apologizing though.
Whoever she dates can decide for themselves if they want to continue seeing her after the first date. It’s not like she’ll be hiding this from them for 2 years and revel it right before the wedding.
OP responded:
Oh yeah I apologised immediately but she’s still in a huff with me, and now I just wonder if I should’ve kept my mouth shut tbh.
its_about_thecones responded:
I think you were coming from a genuinely good place when asking about it and wanted what was best for her. I can also see why she would be upset. Every person she meets probably sees her wheelchair first, and who she is as a person second. A life time of that would probably be exhausting.
Talking to someone on an app without disclosing the wheelchair may be the first time she gets to know someone without that detail being at the forefront of their mind. Being told/questioned about putting that information in her bio takes that opportunity away from her.
ninja_fox50 wrote:
"This confused me because it’s very obvious she is in a wheelchair and if they went on a date in person they would find that out very fast."
Have you considered that there is maybe a step or two between them reading her profile and them going on a date.
I think it would be weird to not bring it up before meeting in person, but I think it's fine to leave it out of the profile and then bring it up in chat/messages or whatever. Some people would definitely not try and connect with someone with a disability, but be okay with it if they were clicking with the person.
OP responded:
Oh I get that entirely, don’t mistake me, the fact that confused me more is that she didn’t tell anyone anything till they met in person. If it were me, I’d want to know at least before showing up to the date - I know there’s plenty of chatting in between and then it’s not relevant but to say nothing at all and just let them be shocked on the day? That seems odd to me?
SLJ7 wrote:
I am a totally blind independent guy in my 30’s. With that out of the way, I’m going to go with NTA. It’s a soft TA for Caroline, but she is still TA in this situation. I am also in a position where I can never be around someone in-person without my disability being visible.
It causes people a lot of discomfort. I don’t like that it causes discomfort, but it does. I am not on dating apps and I think they’re quite toxic overall. People do lie on them. I don’t believe that makes it okay for Caroline to lie, but I can understand the appeal.
People really lose their mind when they see someone with a disability, and I think the idea is that if you’ve already gotten to know someone and then you find out about the disability after knowing the person, you’re less likely to react badly.
I believe that theory holds weight. I think it’s okay for her not to disclose it in her profile, and to get to know someone a little and make sure they hit it off before she tells them.
However, I think waiting until the first date is going too far. More importantly, it will result in a lot of wasted time on her part, because the people who are going to be sh#$ty about it will show up, see the wheelchair and leave. For her sake more than anyone else’s, she should let them know before meeting so she can rule out those people.
I think it’s good to wait a little while to disclose.
First impressions are powerful things, and if someone’s first impression of her is “disability”, they’re going to remember that more than anything else.
If someone’s first impression of her is “this person is interesting and I want to get to know her more”, and then they learn about your disability, they’re going to be more likely to react with curiosity and open-mindedness while still respecting the person they’re getting to know.
You’d be TA if you said she should absolutely disclose it on her bio, but you actually considered the balanced approach and I don’t think it’s wrong to point this out. I think she might have interpreted what you said as meaning “I should tell them so they have a chance to run away.”
I think what you really meant was “It’s going to be jarring for someone to talk to you a lot, meet you, and suddenly see a wheelchair, and you should warn them so things go better for you.” Some people with disabilities have some internalized ableism and shame of their own, and it may have been difficult or even triggering for her to hear that, even if you said it with the best of intentions.
If you feel like this has damaged your relationship with her and you feel comfortable, you may want to clarify. Disability-related conversations can be a minefield, and there’s a lot to unpack. But at the end of the day I do think you made a valid point. The able-bodied person’s experience matters too.
OP responded:
Absolutely! You nailed what I was thinking entirely!
Thank you for your thoughts, that was really helpful!
Not long after posting, OP shared an update.
Update: Since there’s been a few questions or comments about various parts of this I feel obligated to share more info. I apologised IMMEDIATELY after she got huffy with me, I did not just let the matter sit. Whilst she is still a little bit off with me, we have not stopped speaking by any means.
Whilst she is a coworker, I would say we are also “light” friends given we get dinner together once a week and catch movies together, share hobbies etc. but I don’t know how well our connection would be if we didn’t see each other 5 days a week - if that makes any sense?
There are people you meet through work that become lifelong friends and those that are friends throughout their shared workplace but fade after. I just don’t know where we stand in terms of that yet. I have stated, and continue to point out, that I NEVER would have said what I thought if she had not asked me for my opinion.
It isn’t my business how she dates, and I fully understand (even if I can’t relate) that dating with a disability is not easy and there is a lot of warning signs she needs to be aware of (like people with fetishes and so on) and I recognise that she should NOT put the information in her bio - however, to not disclose it before the first date, when they are about to meet in person for the first time, is the main point.
Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, we met today at work and had lunch together (as we often do) and she brought up the conversation from the other day. Caroline admitted that she wasn’t angry with me but more with herself, because, in her words: “I know it isn’t right to not tell them if we’re going to meet up, but I think it’s easier to hide it at first and judge their reaction in person."
"I know it’s not the right thing to do if I really like a guy but sometimes it’s less daunting when they don’t know.” I explained I understood and that I didn’t judge her, I just hoped she could understand that she asked me what I thought and I don’t like to lie but I probably should have not said anything.
We agreed that it’s a very nuanced subject and each person with disabilities has it different, so it’s hard to say what works for each person. Caroline said she would try being more honest in the future with potential partners and I said it wasn’t my place to judge and I wished her luck with dating in the future.
All in all, we both acknowledged we were both “AHs” and “not AHs” - it’s a difficult subject and neither of us has a place to say what everyone should or shouldn’t do when dating.
The internet was glad to hear the update.
Someoneyoudontknow70 wrote:
NAH. You're entitled to your ideals and opinions, and she's entitled to hers. Her lived experience is that she gets far fewer tinder hits if she adds the information to her bio, so she opts to leave it out because she wants people to at least get to know her before rejecting her on that basis. Feel free to lay all your cards on the table in your personal tinder profile.
OP responded:
Yeah, I think she’s absolutely entitled to live the way she wants and I don’t really think she’s being a “bad” person in anyway for hiding the information on her tinder. She asked what I thought about it, I replied honestly but now I wonder if I’m a prick for telling the truth.
rocket-c4t wrote:
NTA. People lie about silly mundane things in dating apps - not being able to walk is not one of those things. The people who would swipe left if they saw the wheelchair in her picture aren’t more likely to be into her if they get that information by surprise on a first date.
She’s an AH if she isn’t disclosing that within a few messages. Also, don’t ask questions that you don’t want the answer to. If she didn’t want an outside opinion she should’ve kept it to herself.
JazzyCher wrote:
NTA I'm not phased by potential partners being in wheelchairs, ive talked to a few on tinder and other dating apps.
What is an absolute deal breaker is lying about it and hiding it because if you can't tell me something like that about yourself I'm immediately going to assume you're lying about a hell of a lot more and going to be hiding things from me off the bat and I don't like to play games like that.
New_Pressure_1309 wrote:
It’s not a tough one at all. She said everyone lies on dating apps so it’s okay - it’s not! It’s pertinent information - a genuine connection needs to start from a place of honesty and if you are omitting such an important detail about yourself you are being misleading. NTA I understand how she feels but this is not the way to go about it.