'AITA for calling an ambulance for an old man who refuses to go to the ER?'
"AITA for calling an ambulance for an old man who refuses to go to the ER?"
My(F21) mother(F56) has been dating a man(M70~) for a while. Since I was in high school probably. He's lived with us for a while now and moved with us to our newer home, where I live in a sort of apartment in the upstairs portion of their house. The man, we'll just call him Jean, has been having serious health problems for a little while now.
Stuff like his leg not working, or constantly falling. It's scary for my mother, whose father died back in 2020 after falling and hitting his head. He had refused to go to a hospital and by the time he got treatment it was too late and he passed away.
She's traumatized from this and Jean is also refusing to go a hospital, saying stuff to her like "I'd rather pass here than in a hospital" and complaining that it's emasculating to go and get care.
Last night she took him to the ER because he couldn't move his left leg and he was extremely lethargic and had problems seeing. But he changed his mind in the waiting room and demanded she take him home. She did.
I keep telling her she needs to get him care whether he wants it or not but she's afraid to upset him. I've thought about it and I'm considering calling an ambulance and having them take him to make sure he's not about to pass away in front of my mother. Not for his sake, but for my mother's. She's fragile and I genuinely don't know what would happen if he died like this.
Would I be TA for calling an ambulance against his wishes? Please note that money is not an issue as he's relatively wealthy and is retired, which is something I've considered because I tend to prefer driving to the hospital to avoid the ambulance fees.
Here's what people had to say to OP:
Additional_Breath_89 wrote:
Honestly. Kinda YTA If you know for sure he’ll refuse care, then it’s just wasting the time of the ambulance teams. Also, I don’t know much about American care - it won’t be get charged for an ambulance call out potentially? He has the right to refuse care. You don’t have the right to make the choice for him.
Obviously. If he is in a medical emergency, whip out that phone! But if not? Then no. I get trying to help your mum, but she’s been with him for a while. And is able to look after herself. Finally - neither will forgive you for trying to butt in. Again. If it’s a medical emergency, whip out that phone. But if not? Not your place.
OP responded:
I mentioned in the post that money is not a concern for him, he's got good insurance and is relatively wealthy but I agree that it might be an AH move to essentially force the charges on him if insurance doesn't pay it.
I'm just concerned that he's going to downplay an actual medical emergency. He downplays a lot of his problems because he finds them emasculating or embarrassing. My mom told me once that she was almost positive he was mid stroke and he still wouldn't let her take him in, so I'm concerned about anything worse.
FacetiousTomato wrote:
I don't think it would make you an AH, but I don't think it is your place either. If he is still reasonably "with it" he gets to make (and live/die with) his own bad choice. Same goes for your mother.
Different story if you think dementia is at play.
OP responded:
I'm unsure of his mental state as I don't spend time down there with them but from what I can tell he's lucid
I'll hold off on calling an ambulance this time but if something worse happens I still might.
Jazzycher wrote:
Okay I'm not going to make a judgement because there are a few things you need to know here. He can still refuse care from an ambulance as long as he is mentally sound. Ambulance crews cannot kidnap people against their will and forcibly take them to the hospital, its a crime.
However you said he had become lethargic at one point, was he confused? If he becomes lethargic again you can call an ambulance and if he is not mentally sound (knows who he is, where he is, what day/time/year it is, and recognizes important events) they can take him to the hospital as Altered Level of Consciousness.
But, if at any point he is able to accurately answer those questions independently, he can refuse more treatment. The most you'd be able to do is get him screened in an ER while he is lethargic and confused but as soon as he is able he will continue refusing treatment.
The problems he has are likely thing that would require regular care, which is not something you can force on him. If he rapidly deteriorates you can call an ambulance but as long as he is mentally sound they will not force him to go against his will.
KittenKingdom000 wrote:
You're better off calling Adult Protective Services. Self neglect is a reason for involvement and they may be able to force him to get medical attention. He can still refuse for the most part, but they can do other things like mental health eval and stuff where he may just go to a doc to avoid the whole mess. Sounds like stroke symptoms, definitely serious if he's losing use of a limb.
OP responded:
Thank you, I'll look into this.
Katzakat wrote:
NTA for calling. The paramedics can come and check him out. They can't make Jean go to the hospital. Jean will likely refuse again, as is his right. Some may consider you're calling to be a waste of resources. It could be a wake-up call to Jean to get proper care. Are you looking at moving out anytime soon? Leave your mom and Jean to figure out their relationship together.
OP responded:
Would love to move out and I'm generally not involved in anything that goes on downstairs. It's just when I do stuff with my mom she tends to vent to me about all of this, and I had to help her get him in the car last night so I was worried.
ConflictGullible392 wrote:
Not an AH but I don’t think the ambulance would transport him against his will, assuming he is conscious and lucid.
OP responded:
I wasn't sure about that, thank you.
Kettlebellbabe wrote:
NTA but he'd still have the right to refuse service. Just cause an ambulance shows up doesn't mean they have to take him or that he has to go (assuming he's conscious and can communicate when they arrive).