'AITA for listing out a woman’s insecurities on a first date?' 'She stood up, almost in tears.'
"AITA for listing out a woman’s insecurities on a first date?"
A few days ago, I (18F) went on a date with “Elsie” (19F). I had only met her briefly while volunteering and so most of it for me was just getting an idea of who I was talking to. She asked me what my experience in secondary school was like, and I mentioned that I used to get bullied.
Elsie said she used to get bullied for her appearance at school, particularly for her red hair. I said she was a perfect example of medieval western-European beauty standards. She asked how, so I listed some - she’s very pale, has wavy fair/red hair, a high forehead, a long nose, etc.
She stood up, almost in tears, and said I’d just pointed out all her insecurities. She left before I could apologize properly (all I managed to say was “Oh, I’m sorry” with no further explanation). She hasn’t contacted me since then though I have tried to reach out.
I’m definitely missing something as I've been trying to work out why her reaction was so extreme when I thought I was complimenting her, but I can't really piece it together (being autistic certainly has at least something to do with it). AITA?
EDIT:
And for all those saying I should know how "women" think about their appearance, we aren't a monolith. What I think about my own appearance, and how I would feel about this description is different to how Elsie or any other woman would.
Here's what top commenters had to say about this one:
nefarious_planet said:
YTA, but it seems like you’re genuinely confused so like, gentle YTA. She was trying to connect with you, and she shared something vulnerable that probably negatively impacted her.
Think about the way you felt, being bullied for your appearance. She felt the same way, because the same thing happened to her. She tried to share that with you, and what you said next probably came across as incredibly invalidating.
It’s not clear from your post what your intention was in bringing up Western Medieval beauty standards, but to her it very likely came across as you telling her she couldn’t possibly have been bullied for her appearance because she’s conventionally attractive and therefore her experience was not as “real” as yours.
That’s hurtful to hear, especially when she was trying to be vulnerable and connect with you. As for her comment about how you listed out her insecurities, that’s not really your fault because you couldn’t have known what het insecurities were.
Worth-Season3645 said:
YTA…really? You basically just told a first date how she was ugly. How is telling any one that they have a high fore head, long nose a compliment? What you could have said is that I find your red hair very appealing and beautiful. Stop contacting her. Her first impression of you is done. Learn from this and move on.
9and3of4 said:
YTA, a little bit. It's really not a compliment when it's called "medieval." In that context it kinda sounds like you're listing everything about her that's not up to modern standards.
wesmorgan1 said:
You basically told her that she's pretty...but only by the standards of the Middle Ages. Think about that for a minute. YTA.
ClaryClarysage said:
Gentle YTA. No lady wants to hear they have a high forehead and a long nose. Those might have been medieval beauty standards but what they want to hear is that they're attractive by today's standards. What you basically said was "you would have been pretty several hundred years ago."
agirlnamedbreakfast said:
YTA though perhaps well-intentioned? If you had said that she possessed all of the features YOU found beautiful that’s one thing, but everyone who was around in the middle ages is long dead, so that doesn’t do anything for her now.