I have always had a backup plan. My backup plan includes a place to live, money for general expenses and a rainy day fund. It's more complicated than that but that the jist of it. I like having it and I have explained to previous partners that I have one and I let me them decide if they're OK with it.
My fiancé knew this before he started dating me exclusively. He knew that if we ever got married, I would require a prenuptial agreement and a request that this backup plan stays intact. A couple days ago, he told me he wasn't ok with this plan any longer. I don't think that's fair.
He comes from a wealthy family and the prenuptial agreement protects him and I should have something that protects me. I'm actually finding myself really angry about this because I was an open book about this every step of the way and now I feel like he is changed his mind.
He says that having this plan makes it seem like I will leave him while I think it protects me. I'm annoyed because it's not fair to me to change your mind when you knew my expectations from the very beginning.
Edit- I put this post up because I was annoyed that he essentially told me this on Friday, minutes before our meeting with the lawyers. I was and am annoyed, but he follows my reddit account so throwaway.
I don't tell every person about this plan, only ones that I've gotten serious with, which is a grand total of 2. The backup plan is complicated, but it doesn't screw him over in any way.
It protects me and I would be paying for the property and still contributing the same amount that he would be to our household expenses and savings. Now that he knows what the plan entails in depth, he wants to just not sign anything on both sides. This is a bad idea. I would be unprotected, but so would he, and he has way more than I do.
He feels like I have one foot out the door. I don't. I love him. But my dad is a divorce lawyer and, from what I've heard and seen, better to protect yourself and not need it than no protection and then have to pick up the pieces. Both of our parents agree that a prenuptial is needed.
I'm not getting rid of this plan. There is not anything that would make me compromise about this. I told him he has a decision to make because I'm not changing my mind. Yes, I told him about this post as more people have seen it. Rather, he finds out about it from me than someone else or just being on reddit.
Every lawyer that I’ve listened to has said a good prenup protects both parties.
This. It's like a seatbelt for both parties. Having a seat belt doesn't indicate lack of trust in the driver; it just means that you want to maximize your chances of survival should anything go wrong.
Tell him it's non negotiable. He has a backup plan in family wealth, he has no claim or right to your money, your protection.
"He says that having this plan makes it seem like I will leave him."
Isn't the same true about a prenup? That is a document in case he leaves you?
"It's not fair to me to change your mind when you knew my expectations from the very beginning."
Like so many others, he assumed a ring would make you forget those silly things you think are important and you would comply.
He is displaying why you have that backup plan in the first place.
I am making an update because I had people keep messaging me asking about it. I had to split it into two parts. It wont let me post as one. When I made the first post, I was angry because I felt like I had been deceived. I was honest with my fiance from the start and I felt like he had pulled the wool over my eyes.
But I understand his perspective now and he understands mine. It never crossed our minds to break up and I think we both needed some time to think. I understand this is reddit but please don't bash my partner. I understand I was vague but to call him names and try to tear down his character when you don't know him is not ok. I also dont know why I am clarifying things. It's honestly a little therapeutic.
To clarify some things about my backup plan, I called it that because I started it at 25. I have had it for about 10 years now. I'm in my mid 30s. It is an emergency savings account, another savings account, and a property I own. I use my main job to pay for my household expenses with my fiance and also to fill my main savings.
I have a trust but also investments as well but my dad helps me handle those. The emergency savings is only money from additional contract jobs I take on in my profession. The other savings account is only money from rental income, some of which I use to maintain the property and pay my dad back.
The property is a multifamily home and I rent out all the units but one. The property was bought by my dad when I was 24 and I have been paying him back the purchase price with no interest for a couple of years now. The property is worth a great amount now but my dad would only accept what he paid for it from me.
He took out a loan for me because he wanted me to be set up financially. Im paying him back even though he already paid the loan off a long time ago. There's no way I would be able to buy that property now, or even 5 years ago since house prices have skyrocketed where I live and I'm grateful that my dad did that for me.
I will finally pay off the loan in about 8 months and before I get married. It's taken me so long to pay my dad back because he insisted that I prioritize setting myself up financially rather than paying him back.
The property is also a 15 min walk to the nearest hospital and close to the city center so it is easy to rent out to medical students. I keep one unit open because of events. I make a killing when there are events or when big artists tour and two examples are the recent Beyonce and Taylor swift tours where I made alot on the days they were in my city.
If there are no events where I think I can make a good amount, I rent it out to travel nurses in 3-4 month periods once or twice a year but realistically, there could be a couple weeks or 2-3 continuous months during the year where it sits empty.
Overall though, i make a substantial amount from this property. I can't take credit for this strategy because my dad is the one who helped me set up the apartments and manage it.
My partner and I come from vastly different economic backgrounds. His family has generational wealth and he can't remember a time they didn't. I grew up firmly middle class, until my parents' divorce and then it was a struggle for a while. His home life was relatively stable with a mom and dad.
On the other hand, my dad tried his best but my birth mom made my childhood tumultuous both emotionally and mentally. The difference with how we think about money became very noticeable when we were planning our wedding.
We had been discussing what type of flowers we would like and then I started talking about the budget and stated that I thought 30-40k was good overall to pay for a wedding and an amount where we could easily afford it.
He thought I meant 30-40k for flowers and he and his parents didn't budge at the amount and just said ok. I clarified what I meant and I would never ever pay that amount for just flowers.
When it comes to the plan, my fiance knew about it as soon as we were exclusive. I don't agree with people saying I shouldn't have told him. To protect my assets in the prenuptial agreement, I had to.
I also told him because I felt he deserved to know. As we got more serious, especially with marriage, I told him more after talking to my dad and finding out what was ok to say so that he understood the extent of the plan.
The reason I kept saying the backup plan was complicated was due to the prenup my dad came up with. It is very long and protects me very well and my fiance was, in his view, not prepared for the extent of it. My dad and I went to this extent due to what he had seen people do in divorces but also mainly due to his divorce that affected us both.
It didn't help that I further joked that my dad tried to cover for any loopholes, including asking his associates to look over the document and revising it if one was found. What I saw as protection, my fiance saw as me having an out since my dad went to such an extent.
The short part of it is that my fiance was insecure about it. He grew up with a dad as the breadwinner and he was raised with this idea that he should be a provider and my plan rattled him because it showed him that financially I didn't really need him.
He told me he didnt realize how much of himself he had tied into this provider role and felt extremely insecure because he didn't know what he now brought to the relationship. When he found out about the sometimes empty unit, he felt more uneasy because he, even though I have and will always have a job, wanted and planned to take care of me.
His idea of scrapping both prenups was his way of trying to say that he trusted me and that I should trust him. If he was willing to go without a prenup knowing I could get a substantial amount of his assets, then it would show me that he would never try to hurt me financially or otherwise.
I told him I saw it at the time as extremely manipulative due to him doing it before we met with the lawyers and he apologized because he honestly just panicked.
I explained the reasons i wanted a prenup. The first was because I was with him when his brother got a divorce and to put it nicely, the brother's ex-wife financially got eviscerated. I'm not going to talk about their relationship but financially, she just kept being taken back to court over and over until she said she couldn't afford a lawyer anymore.
From the way his brother bragged about it, she wasn't left destitute but she paid a significant amount in legal fees and left with a far smaller settlement. His family would have bankrupted her because they had the wealth to wait her out. They could have gone to court forever and they had a prenup.
His brother's divorce was never on his radar as a reason why I was so persistent about the prenup. Bascially what I said was there was a disparity in wealth here and I know he would never do this to me but I would feel better protected with one.
The second reason is that though my dad is a divorce lawyer and upper middle class now, he went through a pretty bad divorce with my birth mom and i witnessed it for 3 years. My dad is first generation, married young and had no prenup.
What I saw from 9-12 was my birth mom (I no longer consider her a parent) completely try to annihilate my dad and she didn't care that her child's wellbeing was on the line. She didn't care what financial damage she did even to herself as long as my dad suffered.
I'm talking wiping out savings, taking loans and maxing out credit cards, getting tickets and getting the car towed by parking in an incorrect place and leaving the car to accumulate fees. She called cps, said my dad was a pedophile, and turned on me when I wouldn't back up her lies and all of this financially devastated my dad for years during and after the divorce.
We were struggling for years and I think people dont realize how quickly you can go from stable, even upper class to nearly homeless or homeless. People dont realize if you have never been in that postion before how an ugly divorce not only devastates people financially but also socially and professionally.
My dad lost clients and lost income and it took many years to rebuild it back. We only survived because my grandmother (dad's side) sold her home. I told my fiance that I bascially went from having a parent who showed me love for 9 years to a person who hated me and decided to destroy two people (my dad and me) because a marriage ended.
There was no way to stop her and a prenup could have stopped alot of the financial damage. I again told him I knew he wouldnt do this to me but I needed him to understand where I was coming from.
Also if anyone reading this says I'm damaged from this and should have been in therapy from age 9, I know but it's hard to pay for therapy when you're poor. It is the last priority over having a roof over your head and food and basic necessitites. I did get into therapy when I was 19.
My fiance and I talked over several days and anytime he had a question or needed clarification. I answered it. I didn't realize how much seeing the extensive prenup affected him and he didn't realize why I was so insistent on it.
Overall he knows that though I love and trust him, that I have to protect myself and he should too. He knows why I'm insistent on signing a prenup but also knows that im choosing to be with him based on who he is as a person and not what he can provide for me.
I now understand why he felt insecure and I have tried to alleviate that and I'm constantly reassuring him of the reasons I'm with him. I also asked him to come see the property and unit with me and he was really excited about that.
I told him that I don't plan on us breaking up ever and I have a plan for leaving the assets to our future children. Finally I really see how, when it comes to people he loves, he leads with emotion while I'm more logical. So we both are going to try to be more mindful of that as we move forward.
We both finally signed the prenups and his only stipulation was to stop calling mine a "backup plan" and instead call it a "I'm never going to need this" plan. We are good, and im glad this happened because it showed both of us that we need to work on our communication more outside of our counseling. We are going to keep planning our wedding and im excited to begin this next part of our lives together.
Me reading: "My bf is wealthier. My backup plan contains a place to live" - why would you waste money on renting place you dont live in if you have no money?
"I own multi family property" - oooooohh.
Yeah OP was saying she was firmly middle class and "struggled" but her dad is a lawyer and bought a property for her? She's a landlord. I guess we have different ideas of what middle class means. It pales in comparison to her fiancee though. Rich people never think they're rich because they always know someone richer.
Most people believe they are middle class. You can ask a family living in a shi++y apartment making minimum wage and they'd likely call themselves middle class. You can also ask the 500k a year income family with 3 rental properties and they'd call themselves middle class.
My eyebrows went up, down, up and then down again while reading this. I’m glad they communicated and got to understand each other’s POVs — how rare to see on this app. And ofc, the renaming of the plan seemed like a great middleground given that other ideas involving giving up her (very practical!) backup plan would be totally unfair.
I know this is a very small aspect of the overall story but....30-40k for flowers for a wedding ALONE? How f&*king rich is this family?
After the sh!!t Future BIL pulled, how is he suprised? Good planning on the part of OP.
Fiance: we don’t need a pre-nup; my family would never be awful if we divorce.
Fiance’s family: yeah, we already broke that one DIL even though she had a pre-nup.
I’m hope OP’s dad made her pre-nup bullet proof.