Mistakes happen, but some seem more fishy than others.
In a popular post on the Relationship Advice subreddit, a man shared the story of his best friend spilling on his wife, and how his wife suspected it was on purpose. He wrote:
Me and Ailie met through a mutual friend in 2012 during a pub quiz at university. I was quite attracted to her and actually told her so at the end of the evening, but she told me she had a boyfriend even though she was flattered all the same. Fast forward three years later. I meet Eliza at the Edinburgh Fringe and we just clicked immediately.
Politics, music, cinema - whatever the subject approached, there was a spark that I’d never felt with anyone else. Like she just made sense with me. Her personality was just vivid. It’s hard to describe but I’ll try - on first impression, she was so knowledgeable and enthusiastic, I was taken aback by her intensity.
From that point onward, we were inseparable and I was dead certain of our future together long before we got engaged. Enter Ailie again. I start a new job at an advertising firm with a position in web design and she was one of the only people I knew. At first it was a little awkward given our “history”, especially considering that she was now married to the boyfriend she was dating back then.
But there was no one else I knew at the firm and we both had partners at this point, so it couldn’t hurt to be friends right? And to be honest I’m glad because I feel like our chemistry as friends superseded any potential we might have had as a couple. She’s clever and has a bit of a cheeky personality. I’m quite dry and sarcastic myself so I reckon we have a pretty fun dynamic.
Eliza doesn’t seem to feel that way, though. Sometimes when it’s been the three of us she has expressed a feeling of being left out or that Ailie has been making fun of her. I don’t see it - it’s just our dynamic, but there have been a couple of nights where Eliza’s been in tears because of something that Ailie has said.
One time Eliza got out of her seat and Ailie sat down where she was sitting to show me a video on Youtube. When Eliza came back in she saw Ailie leaning next to me and was upset for the rest of the night. Sometimes there have been times when Ailie has said something that Eliza has read as a come on.
Like when I said I missed swimming because I felt out of shape Ailie said “the two of us should go together” with a playful punch. Eliza didn’t say anything at the time but her discomfort was visible. Things really came to a head though on our wedding and I think the stress of it really got to Eliza. During the reception Ailie bumped into her and red wine spilled all over her dress.
She was bawling the entire evening. We’re now on our honeymoon and Eliza has said she hopes for a fresh start but she feels like Ailie might have spilled her wine on purpose. She’s suggesting that I cut ties with her and if I’m honest I’m not so sure I want to. Where do I go from here?
TL;DR wife is getting increasingly insecure about my best friend to the point where she wants us to cut contact. Says that it feels like she’s treating her poorly. I’m at a loss what to do.
The number of times I’ve bumped into someone and spilled my drink on them is exactly once in my entire life and I was a s#$t faced teenager. You are either astoundingly naive or Allie is somehow the unluckiest woman in the world to accidentally spill her red wine on the bride on her wedding day.
I think you know which one is more likely. Your wife won’t be staying your wife for much longer unless you start actually listening to her and stop dismissing all of her fears as baseless insecurities.
Ailie was getting a drink from the bar, Eliza had taken off part of her gown for dining and dancing purposes and was leaving our bedroom to return to our table - they bumped into each other and Eliza had a huge red stain over her dress. Ailie made an offhand joke and fled, and Eliza ran up to me in bits and pieces.
It sounded really bad when Eliza told me, and she was in bits about the wine spilling all over her dress, and I went to Ailie and asked her what the hell she was up to. Ailie was so mortified and told me she wanted to sink into a hole, she’s dyspraxic and has struggled with falling at impromptu moments.
I’ve actually witnessed it happening before, there was a meeting at work and she gets our colleagues coffee - the moment she came in she tripped and fell, coffee flying everywhere
Allie bumped into your wife in her wedding dress, spilling wine all over it, and made an offhand joke before fleeing? What kind of response is that?
She’s a really awkward person and doesn’t know how to interact with people sometimes. There have been times I have been upset with her because of how glib she’s been about personal issues.
So someone who has a habit of 'accidentally' saying or doing things that make your wife cry 'accidentally' also managed to spill red wine over her white dress on the biggest day of her life, and you don't think that's at all suspicious?
If you knew - and imagine here that you somehow knew for certain - that she'd done it on purpose, what would your reaction be? Would it change how you thought about her? Give it some thought.
I would be really hurt if Ailie was doing it on purpose. I love Eliza and want us to be happy and I can see that I’ve really f#$ked up here, multiple times. Ailie is a good friend but if she’s deliberately being a wind-up merchant and harming my marriage then I’ll have to cut the cord and stop chumming up to her so much.
Eliza sometimes says to me that she can intuit people’s opinions and feelings within minutes of meeting them. I’ve never been like that, my folks have always said that I’m terrible with picking up on basic things. I was at an aunt’s house when I was a kid, talking her ear off and she said “oh it’s getting late” multiple times, it was only until my mum dragged me out that I picked up that she wanted me to leave
It really sounds like you're putting your friend first. No wonder your wife is unhappy. She comes back in tears from hanging out, and you still invite Ailie to the wedding? What was that conversation like?
She got really upset one time during banter because me and Ailie like to roast each other regularly and Ailie roasted her a little too hard I guess. We were singling out things to insult each other on and the subject went to Eliza and Eliza mentioned that she had webbed feet. Since then Ailie’s called her leapfrog. When I say it Eliza takes it in good stride but when Ailie says it it’s this massive problem. I don’t get it.
Eliza has suggested that Ailie’s being serious when she says it as opposed to when I do, but she roasts me the same way too. She said I looked like a Juggalo’s poodle that day because I was wearing baggy “metal” clothes and hadn’t styled my hair so it was frizzing all over the place.
Why haven’t you stuck up for your wife all those times Ailie has hurt her?
I guess because I didn’t know that I needed to? It seems like it’s a perspective thing. Eliza is a passionate person who cries at Deluxe puppy adverts and the intensity is great for a partner but it can cause problems with friendships. She reads a lot into things her friends do thinking it’s intentional and when she talks to them about what they did, they will be completely shocked and unaware that they hurt her.
Ailie is a very sarcastic person in general who rolls with the punches and to me it reads like they struggle to gel rather than intentional cruelty on Ailie’s part but for what it’s worth Ailie has told me that she’s really keen on Eliza and thinks she’s a top girl.
You know I posted here recently looking for guidance on how to deal with my wife’s anxiety and hurt revolving around my friend and eh seems like I got read the riot act, probably rightly so. I have been completely inconsiderate of Eliza’s feelings and how she feels about these roastings and you alerted me to the possibility that Ailie is doing this just to be a little s#$t.
I sat down with Eliza and we had an in-depth conversation about the wedding incident. I got her to describe the event step by step in her own words:
“I was leaving the lobby into the dining venue and Ailie was a little tipsy at this point and already stumbling from the bar."
"She was initially walking slower but seemed to speed up when she saw me. We collided into each other and she pulled an ashamed face and made a joke about me looking like Rosamund Pike in Gone Girl before scurrying away. She seemed embarrassed in the moment but she didn’t apologize to me."
"I heard from other people that she was appalled about what happened but I never heard anything from her directly. It just paints a picture of habitual microaggressions from her that has festered into this ugly anxiety whenever she’s around."
"I pretty much predict whenever I’m in her vicinity, there will be weird behavior or uncomfortable comments and I don’t want to continue being in a situation where my husband brings someone into my home, who resents me simply for existing.”
That was a real gut punch to me. For me I always felt like it was just insecurity about me fancying Ailie for 10 minutes yonks ago but Eliza is really torn up about this. She’s said that the honeymoon has been miserable because the memory has been swirling around in her mind and she feels like I’m going to downplay or dismiss it. No one should feel like they can’t just be themselves, especially not at home.
I didn’t realize what a s#$thead I’d been and I apologized profusely to Eliza and decided to phone up Ailie to confront her about the wedding incident. So I did and it…it didn’t go well. Basically I told her that Eliza was really hurt by the wedding dress incident, that she had been hurt by her behavior for a long time.
I said if she can’t bring herself to apologize to Eliza’s face at least she should pay towards getting the stain removed - and if she couldn’t bring herself to even do that then our friendship had to stop. To say that Ailie was taken aback would be an understatement. She was completely blindsided, asking what was wrong with their interactions that made me want to go to such extremes.
I mentioned the leapfrog comment and she went “but even you call her that,” stating that Eliza called her Garfield cause of her weight and bright orange hair. When I mentioned that she ran towards Eliza and didn’t apologize for spilling wine on her, she got really upset and started shouting.
She said she wasn’t running at her to hurl wine at her dress, she was running from her because she didn’t want to talk at that moment because she feels like Eliza hates her and she doesn’t know how to go about it.
She started pointing out times when Eliza had been funny towards her and I basically said “right but this isn’t about when Eliza has hurt you, this is about when you’ve hurt Eliza and it’s got so bad that it needs to be talked about” and she started laughing, it was really uncomfortable. I know she does this when she’s anxious about something.
Eliza asked me if things were okay from the other room and Ailie demanded if this was set up and when I tried to explain myself, she hung up. Her husband even phoned me, insisting that he would pay for the damage if it is less stressful for me. I told Ewan (husband) that I appreciated that but I needed to know where Ailie stood regarding what I just said.
Ewan told me that Ailie makes jokes whenever she’s anxious or uncomfortable and that they’ve rowed about it in the past but the wedding dress incident is a major issue and that he wants to smooth things over as much as I do. So him and Ailie will pay towards dry-cleaning, whilst a condolences hamper is sent to Eliza.
Eliza was relieved that Ewan was so understanding, but she wasn’t thrilled about Ailie’s reaction. Basically said that the Garfield comment was always about her hair and never about her weight and that she was deliberately trying to make it seem like the bad behavior went both ways. I don’t think it’s went both ways either, cause I’ve never noticed Eliza roasting Ailie in any real way.
Eliza has suggested we try marriage counseling - I was a bit shocked at first because we’ve only been married a month lol! But I decided maybe that’s the way forward because if Eliza reckons that we need counseling for it, then it’s clearly a problem. So yeah, me and Eliza are going to try marriage counseling and my future with Ailie is uncertain.
Don’t you think it’s really odd that your friend, after ruining someone’s wedding dress, made a joke like that? People don’t usually think of things like that right after doing something that bad. For Ailie to then paint a picture of being appalled for other people, but to not show your wife that or offer your wife an apology? It’s really not hard to see that Ailie has no respect for your partner, literally none.
I don’t even understand why Ailie is still a part of your life at all. Who remains friends with someone who repeatedly makes their partner cry? You’re not really going believe someone behaving normally in this situation would be blindsided by your call, right?
You would expect a call about cleaning a dress, if anything, or you yourself would be making a call to apologize. I think it’s quite clear that Ailie was blindsided because she feels like she can get away with this s#$t. How do you spill red wine on someone while running away from them? Her story doesn’t even make sense.
Your future with Ailie is uncertain? Cut the cord before this ends your marriage. Keeping someone around who ruined your wife’s experience of her Wedding Day? Who you recognize has actively hurt your wife…and there’s not a chance that happened unknowingly? Someone who is literally trying to tell you the woman she was bullying makes her uncomfortable. What a terrible idea.
Your future with Allie shouldn't be uncertain. It should be OVER. She's shown you and your wife who she is, believe her, and move on. Your marriage will NOT survive that friendship. I promise you that.
Eliza should be the priority. Your "friend" is hurting her deliberately and you are helping.
When you're alone because you did not value your marriage and Ailie gets bored from ruining your life it's gonna be so lonely but that's karma.
I agree with all the thoughts on Ailie. She’s so full of it and her behavior is atrocious. How you’ve been fine with Eliza crying after being around her is beyond me. I do want to point out that Eliza’s fear that you would diminish and dismiss her upset about the wine incident was what you actually did. You came to Reddit bc you were ready to get an it’s no biggie bite and move on.
It took internet strangers telling you this wasn’t ok to take your wife’s concerns seriously and have a long overdue talk. I hope couples therapy helps your communication and empathy with Eliza.
So after the rightly deserved bollocking you gave me in the last post, you’ll be happy to learn that Ailie and me aren’t talking anymore, and it’s probably for the best. Eliza and me received the condolences hamper in the post and it was primarily…soaps. Not in the sense of fragrant body lotions or luxury packages, or even organic bars…just regular, run-of-the-mill soaps.
There were two dispensers that were faintly rose scented but it was so mild you had to really look for it. There were several white soap bars that didn’t smell of anything, really, it was so confusing. The only items that suggested it was a proper gift basket were a £6 bottle of Chardonnay and a box of Roses chocolates that looked a fair deal more effort than the cleaning equipment at the nearest pub.
The weirdest item though? A pair of women’s underpants. Not lingerie, not anything lacy or risqué, like - just a plain pair of white pants. They were actually kind of grubby, there was a faint orange lining on them. It just didn’t make sense to me because if they were meant to be for Eliza, they were at least six sizes too big.
And if Ailie really WAS making a move on me, they were again around six sizes too big - also, why would she choose such disgusting pants to try and “seduce” me? It weirded me out so much I rang up Ailie, asking why I had soap and grubby knickers in our condolences hamper. She kept making dry remarks to her husband about there being a strange noise on the other end of the phone.
I didn’t get anywhere with her and insisted that Ewan should talk to me instead because getting anywhere with her was like pulling teeth at this rate. After some disgruntled remarks, she passed the phone over. Ewan asked what was up and I explained the whole situation. He was momentarily surprised when I described the hamper as looking like the luggage of a janitor that lived under a bridge.
He said that it was a small package, but there should have been several luxury gifts that weren’t simply sanitary items. Apparently there was a bottle of Chardonnay, a bottle of Shiraz, one box of Rose chocolates, a Lindt bar, a selection of crackers and some assorted cheeses.
Somehow that got replaced with leftover soaps bought in bulk and his Y-fronts that Ailie found ever so hilarious and apparently found ever so hilarious to send to my wife. He was hugely apologetic and embarrassed, stating that he’d pay us the cost towards the lost items. I was raging at this point but I tried to be collected and said “right, let me talk to Ailie again please” and he got her on the line.
I told her that she had the chance to make it right and she blew it, and she groaned and told me that Eliza’s jealousy has crippled our friendship and she was sick of having to flatter her insecurities. I said no, you ARE Eliza’s insecurities and we rowed for a bit. Eventually it ended with me saying that this had been building up for a while and that her attitude had been giving Eliza grief for years.
Ailie said “none of this would be happening if Eliza knew how to take a joke” and I just told her that a joke isn’t ruining her wedding dress and then sending her your husband’s stinky Y-fronts. She said I sold out my principles for a girl who’s threatened by other women.
After the phone call Eliza was not so much hurt as she was confused at first, because she was wondering if there was a mix-up until I explained to her the “joke”. She seemed pretty much resigned to the idea that Ailie would always be a s#$t, and I told her the likelihood of that happening was very slim considering she’s cut me off for standing up for her.
I think the counselling has made us stronger and in a weird way I’m glad this happened. Because if your friendship falls apart the moment you try to protect your loved ones, then they probably weren’t that strong friendships at all. Shame I won’t be speaking to Ewan from now on, he’s a top lad.
I just hope that you finally feel stupid and YOU APOLOGIZE AND MAKE IT UP TO YOUR WIFE. How the f#$k didn’t you know your friend was bullying your wife is beyond me.
I have apologized to Eliza, multiple times. I should have been more assertive with Ailie and told her to cut her sh*t out then. I’m aware that this is entirely on me for being permissive towards someone who was really just being a bully towards my wife. Am trying to do better.
I'm glad you're seeing the light, but WHY were you permissive before? why was it only now did you finally believe her and confront Ailie? Did you like the attention? Was it easier to dismiss your wife's concerns as being petty over a crush than to critically consider her feelings and the situation? Also, don't you still work with Ailie?
I think it was because I saw it as “lost in translation” - like it was something that worked with me and Ailie but didn’t with her, and assumed that she would figure that it was the sort of banter we encouraged and join in at some point. Eliza’s from a very sincere, straightforward family that say what they mean and don’t necessarily make jokes like I do.
The whole idea would be lost on them and they would be really confused and upset thinking that we were actually insulting each other. Eliza’s brother nearly jumped me once just because I said “that’s plenty” when she was rambling on a little (that’s a Still Game reference for the transatlantic pals across the world). I like it when she rambles, I think it’s cute and it’s a running joke between us.
But he found it so personally offensive though, like he thought that I was just telling her to put a sock in it and started ranting at me for disrespecting his sister like that. Eliza started hiding her face in shame, it was that extreme a reaction. I think I should have been paying more attention though.
Eliza told me that when she’s tried to chat to her Ailie’s just been like “I don’t do small talk” and they’ve sat in complete silence. Apparently when she tried to chat at another time she was totally noncommittal and yawned so loud that it woke up our dog. I only found this out recently because Eliza didn’t want to inconvenience me and I feel so ashamed of my behaviour.
I felt like there was just crossed wires but Ailie really was bullying Eliza and finding creative ways to essentially make her uncomfortable and squeeze her out of our dynamic. I don’t know why or how she thought any of that was appropriate but it’s irrelevant as my wife should never be scared of telling me how she really feels. Yeah I work with Ailie.
That is a complication that I hadn’t considered. I wouldn’t worry about her causing drama in the workplace because she values her job greatly but I wouldn’t be surprised about some passive aggressive attitude being thrown my way. Oh well. I guess I’ll have to wait and see what happens but I’m uninterested in any form of reconciliation if she’s going to be that disrespectful.
You should get ahead of this and tell HR that she sent you underwear. She sounds like the person that will try to get you fired or look like the bad guy at work.
She’s not loopy like that, she’s more likely to make a passive aggressive dig. She’s more being petulant that she has to apologize because she doesn’t want to apologize in the first place. She made stupid comments in the phone call about Eliza being emotionally manipulative and feeling like she “creates a mood.”
I'm wondering if the underwear was OP's. I have a theory he slept with Allie just before the wedding and that's what set her off.
I didn’t. I stopped fancying Ailie in 2012 after she said she was taken. I didn’t sleep with her and I don’t really care for that kind of speculation, it’s just untrue and adds more fuel to the fire. People come across this stuff irl and it just exacerbates problems.
Eliza came across one of the videos about my post on YouTube or TikTok and it stirred up a lot of painful feelings, especially reading about your reactions. She was shocked that I sought online advice, because I usually try to handle things by myself. She was more shocked by the comments, that were overwhelmingly on her side.
It helped her acknowledge how sh#$ty and awful everything done to her had been and we had a long talk about it. I’ve agreed not to talk to Ailie, as she is clearly only interested in causing trouble for a cheap laugh. I mentioned the situation to HR (even the stinky underpants) and they said they’d speak to her and keep an eye on any potential developments but so far no trouble.
As far as I know Ailie’s been having lunch with another colleague and I now go down to a neighbouring cafe to grab a baked potato. Whenever I’ve been in her vicinity she’s just mumbled “alright” so I’m guessing there were some words (between her and HR I mean).
Well, that solves that then.